Mondo Hollywood | Robert Carl Cohen

good evening everyone welcome to the Billy Wilder theater home of the public programs for the UCLA film and television archive my name is Paul Malcolm I'm the senior public programmer at the archive before we begin as a land grant institution the film and television archive at UCLA would like to acknowledge our presence on the traditional ancestral and unseated territory of the Gabrielino and tongva peoples we are humbled to do work in this Community maske wearing is encouraged uh in but voluntary in the theater if you would like a mask and don't have one our theater staff can provide you one on request out in the lobby all of the archives well sorry we would like to thank all of the individuals and organizations that have uh helped to make tonight's screening and all of our screenings possible all of the archive screenings in the Wilder are free thanks to a gift from an anonymous donor and we are grateful to them for their support I also want to thank tonight's special guest of honor Robert Carl Cohen and his daughter di Cohen and the entire Cohen family for making all the help and support they did in making this program possible yeah Round of [Applause] Applause so it is my privilege to welcome you to the first of a two night program celebrating the work of filmmaker Robert Carl Cohen in addition to his work behind and in front of the camera Robert was has worked as a foreign correspondent author photographer lecturer a career in life to accomplished too unique and too fascinating to do it justice in just a single weekend but we're going to do our best born in 1930 Robert graduated from UCLA with a bachelor's degree in 1952 and earned his MFA from the UCLA School of Theater Arts and Motion Pictures in 1954 for his thesis film the color of man after attending the sorban in Paris where he pursued a doctorate in social psychology he found himself embarked on a professional Journey that could be the subject of a movie itself and probably should be if there's any screenwriters in the audience at the end of the Q&A take your notes home and write up that script it's going to be quite amazing um as the cold war deepened in the late 19 1950s and early 1960s Robert traveled the world as a special correspondent for NBC and as an independent documentary producer in films such as inside red chiner and film lectures on East Germany and Cuba under Castro Robert presented us audiences with their first glimpses into countries and peoples on the other side of the ideological conflict that dominated all of their lives assuming the risks of being the first US journalist allowed to film in these far-flung places Robert showed equal courage at home when he turned his camera on how the Cold War was impact in the politics and culture of the United States case in point his 1962 essay film committee on unamerican activities was the first film made by a US citizen to directly challenge the US government and its Cold War uh Cold War uh domestic policies we'll be screening inside red China and uh committee on unamerican activities on Sunday with Bob here in person as well so please come back for that as to what motivated him to take on these challenges at the time Robert remarked recently quote my political motivation was that the world shouldn't go up in a big boom I was definitely trying to make a statement that people can understand it's not necessary to have World War II my basic motivation is to have a good time which is a fitting sentiment for tonight's program we begin our tribute to Robert Carl cooh with two Works connected in their own way by an awareness of how the times and places we find ourselves living shape us and who we are and who we can be first we present Mr whester the time twister an animated short Robert made in 1956 while he was living in France it will be followed by his best known film Mondo Hollywood a multifaceted and fascinating Time Capsule of this everchanging city that is become a classic Touchstone for its residents including filmmaker Paul Thomas Anderson who cited it as an influence on his 2014 film inherent Vice I first saw Mondo Hollywood in a screening at the American Cinema Tech at the Egyptian Theater with uh Paul Thomas Anderson and Bob up on stage and that's how long bob and I I met him after the screening and we started talking about doing this event that was back in 2014 so it's been a while making this happen um and I'm so happy that uh we're finally able to make it uh to have Bob here as our guest of course for anyone who has ever heard him speak or tell a story there is no better person to talk about Robert Carl Cohen than himself uh as I am sure Bob will tell you it took us a while to bring this tribute to work together this tribute to work together but I couldn't be happier to have him here as I said so please help me welcome to the stage Robert Carl Cohen [Applause] good evening thank you for coming and it's my great pleasure to be here to be alive and I hope that you enjoy the films the first film we're going to see Mr Wister is a little cartoon now I did my master's degree at UCLA in film I was then drafted and the US Army sent me eventually to Paris the Supreme headquarters and I got my discharge there and I was working on my doctorate at the sorbon and a French distributor who I bumped into had seen my Master's film from UCLA and he invited me to make a cartoon in Paris and that's the first film we're going to see I wrote and designed the film and that the French designers did all the design work and so on and I'll be happy to answer questions a afterwards and of course then we'll see the infamous Mondo Hollywood so without further Ado let's start the first thing I want to thank you all for sitting through the whole film it's a long film that's the re-edit though that's so the uncensored version and and if I were to make it again today I would tighten it up a bit well thank you Bob for joining us on stage and Dianna thank you for being here with us as well thanks Paul yeah my daughter Diana uh is in the film she's a little child in the swing going back and forth and the song that's being sung while she's doing that is being sung by her late mother Ela so it was a family production in a [Applause] sense so I'm gonna ask a few questions to get us started then we're going to turn it over for the audience and when I turn it over and I call on you wait for the mic to come down and uh ask your question but Bob so I wanted to start first with Mr Wister the short film at the uh that we began the program with can you tell us a little story about how that film came came about as an animated film it's a little different from the rest of your filmography so how how did that film come about well I went to film school to stay out of the army it all right from 52 to 54 I got my my bachelor's in art I I was a painter and I got my bachelor's in art here at UCLA and then the war was on and whereas World War II was my kind of War I was very unhappy at the age of 15 that I hadn't had a chance to get in there and kill people but by the time Korea came along I changed my opinion I I learned a few things and and so I went to school and to to get my degree and then they drafted me and through a SE a sequence or series of events which I won't bore you with I was sent to Paris to Supreme headquarters and I liked it in Paris and so when the end of my service came I was discharged in Paris and I was just living there on the GI Bill and uh one day uh I drove down to the con Film Festival uh and I happened to have with me my Master's dearch film from UCLA which was a little 10-minute film about skin color called the color of man which you can see on the internet today still the only movie made on the topic uh I thought it would be a very popular Topic in 54 the Supreme Court had done their integration decision and I thought that the public would be interested why people had different color skin so I made this little 10-minute film so I drove down to the KH Film Festival sleeping in my car which I got with my GI bill money and they were having a small Festival of film there so I went in there and I said I have a little 10-minute film if you'd like to screen it so they showed it at the con film festival at a little side festival and uh a French producer came over to me and he said I produce films here in France uh uh do you think you could help me break into the American market and I said well I'm certainly not a successful producer or I just have a a college degree doesn't mean much I so I wrote Mr wher the first film you saw I said well I'll I'll write you a little seven minute film and uh the TV is was black and white then and so by doing a little seven minute cartoon in color he thought we might break into the American Market he got Michelle who did the Edith poops music to do the the music and so on and uh that was my that was so I had now had two little films the color of man and Mr wer and um I was waiting for World War II frankly because I had been handling I I've been stationed at Supreme headquarters in Paris I had a what was called The Cosmic clearance uh which I won't bore you with uh it just meant I could handle all the NATO secrets and and um I found out that uh there was a a um a big Youth Festival in Moscow and for 135 bucks you could go there by train from London return with two weeks Ruben board in Moscow so I thought well I get 110 a month on the GI Bill for just a couple bucks more I'll go to mosow because the world is going to come to an end any moment now I I had handled the plan I knew okay and I might as well go to Moscow might as well go there as any place else so I went to Moscow and uh those of you who are old enough there maybe a few surviving people here over 90 years old 80 years old um the Chinese amazingly enough wanted to be friendly and they invited any American who was in Moscow to come to China but our government had a policy Banning travel to China so I was not going to go to China so I knew the CBS guys because I'd been work while I was in the military I'd been at Fort Mammoth New York New Jersey for a while and I had done some research for socalled adventure which is the American Museum of Natural History CBS production so I knew the CBS guys in Moscow and uh Dan Shore the CBS bureau chief came over to me and he said are you going to accept one of these invitations to China I said Dan we're not supposed to go to China we're forbidden to go to China he said if you accept an invitation will you film for CVS I said well that creates a dilemma doesn't it I know I don't know Breck about China okay I never took a course in China in fact in my entire education including six years of UCLA I never read one word about China okay he said will you film for CBS in China and I said if I do my name is going to be on The Black List I'll never work for a government contract again you they and so on however if I don't I'm going to kick myself in the ass for the rest of my life so I said I guess I will so the next day he came and he said I just spoke to New York CBS says no the Columbia broadcasting system will not do anything in violation of the state department travel ban I said then I'm not going to China he said but NBC wants to talk to you so I said ah now remember I've been i' done six years at UCLA I knew who owned CBS I knew who owned NBC I said oh it's Rockefeller instead of Morgan it's very simple so I went to see LaVine and he said well you're not going to work for for CBS I said no no no they don't want to defy the travel band he said will you film for us I said what will you do for me he said we'll give you a camera and we'll give you the old film we have in M remember it was two days notice and we'll pay you for what we use and I said and what about the stuff you don't use he says we'll give that back to you well it wasn't going to cost them anything really an old camera and a couple rolls to film so I accepted I went to China I filmed for six weeks in China I came back to the States NBC bought less than one and a half minutes of film and gave me back everything else which included Mai Tong Cho and Li the Chinese Air Force all the important stuff that did you think they would want it was against their policy to show to anybody so you as the American public what you get to see then like now is totally controlled by some guys in New York who decide what they're going to let you see and not let you see and even though NBC had this footage but they didn't have to pay for it they gave it to me and with these few scraps of film we're talking about 20 minutes 22 minutes of film I was able to put together a show which I called inside red China and I started lecturing around the United States and found out even though I hadn't taken any course in public speaking that I could make a th000 bucks a day by standing next to the screen and talking so I became a celebrated public lecturer and was making pretty good money at the time I I'll just interrupt say we will be showing inside red China on Sunday so you will get a chance to see it on Sunday if you come back for sure I mean that's a vers of movie that I made you know in defiance of the travel band is actually going to be shown here at UCLA Sunday on Sunday so at any rate I being a normal human being desirous of making money easily found that all I had to do was stand next to the screen and talk and show old movies well inside red China became a big hit and is being shown even now okay somebody said to me why don't you make another movie in a communist country I said I have no ambition of making movies in communist countries in fact I have very little ambition about making movies any place I'm just trying to have a good time what I learn in the Army is that the world is going to come to an end at any moment there is nothing going to stop it it's going to happen one guy someplace is going to push a button and once the first button is pushed the [ __ ] will hit the fan everybody will launch all systems and we'll all be vaporized I got nothing to lose so I went I tried to get into Russia so I went to the Vienna Youth Festival in 59 and I contacted the Russians I said hey I just made a film in China and people in the states like it can I get into Siberia because Siberia is mysterious place they said only if your state department lets our camera crew into the states well it wasn't time for that I was in Europe so I went to East Berlin and in 3 weeks I ConEd the East Germans into letting me film throughout East Germany so that was my second film was called inside East Germany and I started lecturing I lectured at UCLA I gave three lectures in one weekend Full House at Roy mid Royce Hall well my lecture agent says to me Bob you're making a lot of money now I said yeah that's groovy can you get into Cuba I said Sid just because the country goes commi doesn't mean I have to go there to make a film I didn't spend two years in the film department at you in order to go in the communist countries I no I was going to say so when did when did somebody identify Hollywood as the next communist country that you should be going to film well that that's what happened next so anyway I want the filming I I said if the state department will let me go to Cuba I'll go to Cuba I'm tired of fighting with the state department those poor guys have got to work there in Washington they got to earn a living I don't really give a [ __ ] State Department says Mr Cohen we saw inside red China we saw inside East Germany we're going to authorize you as the first guy to go to Cuba me and my late wife the mother of my darling daughter Diana we were the first and as far as I know only Americans to get State Department authorization to film in Cuba so we filmed in Cuba so now I wandering the country I had so many bookings I couldn't handle them basically I sometimes was on three planes a day doing inside red China inside East Germany and inside Castro Cuba and my lawyer said hey Bob why don't you make another movie I said 'what about there's no more communist countries left he said what about Hollywood I said Hollywood there's nothing here to film it's just a bunch of people who want to be in the movies a bunch of people have come here from all over the world because they've been seeing movies and they think that what they see in the movies something to do with reality here this is just a paved over parking lot there's nothing here there's no content we have no history he said I can get backing I said well that makes a difference so I said okay I'll make a documentary about Hollywood but I don't I've never written a book about Hollywood I've never read a book that I have appreciated about Hollywood I used to hang out at a place called Barney's Beanery it's still there so I went to Barney's Beanery and I stood up at the bar and I said I am going to make a movie about Hollywood and it's going to be about the people who have come to Hollywood from other places because they want to be part of Hollywood so if you have come here from someplace else and you believe in Hollywood and you want to be in a movie about Hollywood and you won't get paid a penny talk to me all of a sudden my the phone is ringing people are knocking at the door Gypsy Boots is coming by at 3:00 in the morning put me in your movie I said you don't get paid I oh no no I don't want to get paid I just want to be in the movie I was Beed by about 50 or 60 people there are 22 in the film I believe and so I said okay this is what I want to do you tell me your story why did you come to Hollywood and why are you here and what are you doing and you I'll film you and then I'll let you narrate your own part I won't I'm not going to write a script because I don't I can't write WR your words so I filmed a bunch of people over about a year and a half and then I recorded them telling their story so that their voices narrating the lines that they wrote I didn't write a single line in the film and that's how it got made I was GNA say yeah that's fantastic story you seem you describe a career sort of shaped by chance happen stance you're in the right place at the right time you're just trying to make a CO trying to make a buck coincidence but I do want to give you some credit because Hollywood Mondo Hollywood captures a moment in American culture in Hollywood that we're still feeling the reverberations from and Echoes from today as the center and the margins the the the the the the the boundaries between them begin to blur the the um at the same time that you I mean the opening speech and the closing speech with Ronald Reagan and some of the stuff you could have shot this last week and I think it would have meant the would have felt like the cultural political moment we have today if I was filming the political leadership of the country today nobody would believe it right I mean I have no words to describe Donald Trump he is beyond all conscious he is a a a being he's he he is he is he is a a phenomena created by the media you know he very little connection with physical objects but you you capture something in Mondo Hollywood about that idea of performance and the media and and a media image being more important than actual the real life you're living I think for some of the people in the film when you were editing all this together did you feel like you were capturing a specific cultural moment did you feel like you were on to something that might have some real resonance well I I I had I was invest I was spending the money of the investors okay okay and I had to show them something okay and and and I really I had not written a script called mandoo Hollywood I had not not read anyone's and now and I still haven't you know this is this is all a a a uh what would you would I don't know I I lack the the words at the moment to describe it but essentially what it is it's a totally subjective illusory phenomena of people who think that there is a place called Hollywood MH and there ain't it's Southern California it's semi arid it's mostly parking lot the people came here to get away from the patent pool in New York around 1905 1910 so they could make movies and and also because there was better sunlight here and and less rain okay I mean it's it's all a losery UCLA really exists I know I went there for several years it's a beautiful campus with really nice sunsets too yeah and but to if I was going to make the same movie today right having hopefully a bigger budget than I had then which was minus zero I would be recording more I would be filming and recording people rather than just filming them editing it out and then finally playing a soundtrack on it I would cover it more in fact I would be producing what would today be called a TV documentary of interviewing hundreds and hundreds of people and selecting out a few dozen from them but even then it's all in the in in the selection there are people who think that Hollywood is this there are other people who think Hollywood is is that okay I think that Hollywood is in the mind human beings through our Mastery of the environment are able to capture images and sound and then present them to each other and so we see movies we go sit in the dark or watch TV and we see images and sound it's all meline even when it's a let me put it this way I was in Moscow I landed in Moscow on October the 6th 1957 on my way back from China I was flying a tup in a tupv Russian aircraft yanos Kadar the prime minister of Hungary at the time was the in the plane so I interviewed him in the plane we landed Moscow it was pandemonium at the Moscow airport thousands of people Milling around and there was IRB LaVine the guy I'd worked for for NBC and I said IRB what are you and these people doing here I I know it's not for me he said the Russ put up some kind of Rocket last night and it's going around and around the world I said well well just a coincidence we happened to be in the air when that happened the next day her calls me in the hotel he says do you want to make another hundred bucks I said of course he why what do I have to do he saids take the camera and go out and film something here in Moscow about this rocket thing so I go to the Moscow planetarium which is closed there's nothing to film there I go around to the back to the court yard there's a big terrestrial globe with a ladder and somebody's done a chalk mark on it so I filmed that I got two and a half minutes I got a film to make a 100 bucks okay that's only good for 20 30 seconds four or five Russian guys come walking I see two of them carrying still cameras and they're standing looking around there's no people there it's winter it's October the 6th it's clo 7th it's closed it's cold and I deduce in my cleverness that must be the Moscow newspaper guys who have come out to take photos for the Moscow newspapers about the people of Moscow responding to this rocket and there's nothing for them to photograph so I go over to them and I say yanu p Maya peruski I don't speak Russian pay franus do you speak French they said yet I say pans yeah was in yiden I said can you speak yish they said yeah we're Jews I said thank God so so I and the Moscow press Corps conspire to deceive the people of the world in Yiddish so I filmed them looking through their telescope at nothing cuz there's nothing to see and they photographed me looking through the telescope at nothing because it's a cloudy sky and finally one of them motions to me and I have give him my camera and he films me looking through their telescope at the clouds a month later I'm in Paris sitting in a cafe and a guy comes over says are you Russian I said well my parents came from there a long time ago why he said I was just in the movie theater they said the people of Moscow looking at SP he said that's Bob Cohen from Paris I said never believe anything you see in a movie on the on the subject of Illusions and not believing what you see in the movies I was really struck by the history of the films the censorship history of the film in France you have on the title card at the beginning of this in the sense that they banned it years later you resubmitted it without any changes and they accepted it because it had been re they you know they oh then now it comports with it's the idea that the meaning of the film changes with the times and the context of the people that are seeing it one time it's offensive and must be banned and years later it's the same movie and oh we can show it how have you how have you felt about the way people have received Mondo Hollywood over the years well jeanny Ma paid me a couple hundred bucks to do that and I also wrote a whole bunch there's a there's a whole series of Mr Wister that someday may get produced okay I I figur a little cartoon figure that has Little Adventures you know no big deal I got paid for doing okay I had no control over the design or anything Bob Paul was actually asking you about Mondo Hollywood not Mr Wester well it's all part of a Continuum okay what was the question again oh just just your your your experience with the film since you made it and how audiences have responded to it Paul Thomas Anderson discovering it and and sharing it at the Egyptian Theater you're sharing it now how have you felt the life of the how how how have you experienced audience's response to the fil actually I liked it when I made it I had fun making it right I I I I I I don't see any reason to make films unless you enjoy it and I had fun making it I get a call from filmx and they say we want to show your movie Mondo Hollywood is filmx filmx is the film festival in Los Angeles for many years you know thing here got some Warner Brothers is it part of AFI um I mean when filmax AFI took over or began after filmx but filmx was a major film festival in La for many years so they they show my ancient film which at that time was 50 some years old at at filmx okay and this guy PT Anderson who wasn't born until 1970 right he was born after I made M hwood he thinks it's a big deal it is yes and so I thought Ruby here's a guy who wasn't born when I made the film he has no frame of reference about what this is but he recognizes that it is essentially churning the [ __ ] in people's mind people you know thinking illusion and this and adventure and John Wayne and Cowboys and all this stuff and he's a talented young man and it's a big honor for me right for him to recognize something made before he was born that there was some Merit to what I did and I was very appreciative of that and because he did that years ago now right okay we're here tonight well you and I I met in the street right outside of the Egyptian immediately after that we I came out of of of of the uh theater after that and there was Paul yes and he said we want to show this at UCLA and I said you may want to show it but you may find that you're not going to be able to show it you had a long history with UCLA and that was only seven years ago right it only took seven years but I'm I'm glad we finally were able to show it and having you here this tonight so I'm going to turn it over to the audience if there's any we have a time for a couple of questions raise your hand I'll call on you we'll bring you a mic and we'll go from there so let me go to the gentleman right here with his hand up oh wait wait wait for the mic to come down to you it's right behind you wonderful film so why is it taking so long for UCLA to show it [Laughter] why is it taking so long for UA to show it well I am not UCLA however I have my own Theory and it has nothing to do with Mondo Hollywood and unfortunately well fortunately has nothing to do with UCLA today day and hasn't for the last 50 60 years but way back then in the 60s early 60s after having shown inside red China in Royce Hall to a standing room crowd UCLA liked me so much University extension say I booked three screenings of inside East Germany which was a silent film lecture was to be Friday Saturday and Sunday mat which was unprecedented was essentially a travelog a silent travel log was going to be shown three times in a weekend okay the Monday before the screening I got a phone call to come in and Screen the film for the Comm whatever they called it so I screened it the next day Tuesday I got a phone call from Francis English the representative of University extension bob you've got to come in we have to talk about your film inside East Germany that's going to be shown next weekend well I smelled a rat of sensitive not so I went in with my lawyer and a copy of the contract and Francis Engish said the committee that saw your film yesterday says you have to do the following submit your introductory remarks and writing they can be no longer than 10 minutes and have to be approved there's to be no question and answer period the sequence on the Nazi newspapers being sold in West Berlin is to be eliminated the sequence on the Concentration Camp memorials is to be limited to 10 minutes with our approval and a few other little things like that caveats I said well Francis are these suggestions or are they requirements she said well you have to do it and I said well I happen to brought along both a copy of the contract and my attorney Mr lwood my attorney what is your opinion he says we have a quite valid contract with the Regents and we intend to honor the contract and if they approach reach the contract we will sue them for a lot of money I said that's your answer that was on Tuesday Wednesday no news Thursday no news Thursday night I get a phone call from an old friend hey Bob I'm coming LA to see your movie on East Germany can you get me some comps I said sure I'll get you comps but they may not show it he said why not I said I'll meet you at Schwabs at 700 a.m. and I'll tell you so I met him up at Schwabs at 7: am. on Friday and I told him that I had been given a list of conditions by University extension that I had no intention of breaching my own contract by fulfilling their requirements he said this would be very bad I said yeah because I'll threw the [ __ ] out of the University he said I have to make a phone call he stepped into the phone booth this was 8:00 a.m. he came out of the phone booth he said your show will go ahead as planned so I went home and at 10:00 a.m. the phone rang and it was Francis English from the University could you come in at 1:00 and you don't have to bring your lawyer so at 1:00 I went in to the office of Dean sheets a man whose existence I was unaware of until that moment he was the dean of extension i' never even heard of the guy I went into Dean Sheet's office and he was sitting there high B and there was Francis English and there was oi Hamilton the public relations officer former press officer officer for M for Admiral Nimitz World War II because I knew everybody's background okay and I said well where were Dean melnitz and Dean AR they were at the screening on Monday I thought they'd be here today or they couldn't make it I said well I wanted to congratulate them because in today's paper it said that they were both given an award by the West German government and were being given a ser tour of all of West Germany's theaters and they were being they were Merit they were being po Mar which is the West German government's medal the same one that guring got for leading van renov Squadron and I wanted to thank these two German professors here at UCLA for winning that great honor and being given that great award by their government now you may think I was being sarcastic and you'd be right so Dean sheet says whatat are you doing between now and Showtime I said what are you doing now and Showtime I said well I'm going to go over to I have a locker in the men's gym I'm still an enrolled student I'm going to put on a suit and tie and look nice and then I'm go to the VD and have something to eat there are no more no restaurants other than the VD in those days he said you don't have to do that I'll meet you at Royce Hall so I go to Royce Hall and and I knew the stage manager remember I had a masters in theater I had done Productions in Royce Hall and he said they want to record your show I said well it's against the contract but I don't give a [ __ ] let them record the show and down in the auditorium was Dean sheet to dean of extension and a man i' never seen before and Dean sheet said Bob come down so I went down he said this is Dr fulmar VOR of the German federal republic I was going to give him one of these but I I I thought better if I just click my heels and the first thing he said was I was in the states all through the war I said so was I I wanted to go kill Germans but they wouldn't let me in I was only 14 and I thought isn't it interesting that the press officer of the West German consulate in La is here in UCLA actually sets foot and he must have something to do with ar and Mel's getting these medals and these rewards and also might have something to do with trying to censor my show so I was aware of all of this history you made me aware of all of this history after we met after the screen at the Egyptian with Paul Thomas Anders anyway wait just goad to make it short I happen to know somebody who knew somebody in Berkeley okay and so I did all my shows on UCLA to a full house Friday night Saturday night and Sunday mat and a Sunday mat I was standing in front of Royce Hall watching people come in and Counting the money I was going to make at two bucks ahead I was going to make a dollar everybody that went in and a man who later became Chancellor came up behind me and he said in my ear one thing I want to know how did you get through to the president and I couldn't resist temptation and I said I have friends in high places I have not been invited back onto the campus until now 58 years later and Bob so you Bob made me aware of all of that history in our first conversations about doing something and then unfortunately my part of the story is far more banale and just boring where scheduling staff changes other things just sort of delay delay delay lots of programs get held off and then I'll I'll take two years for the pandemic too and all that stuff so my side was just sort of just bad timing and scheduling all that kind of stuff but I just do want to say it I am so happy and and real honor to have you back on UCLA property to celebrate your career and your and your work cuz I'm really impressed by it thank you thank you thank you you are a demonstration that there is still intelligent life on the campus there are those who would disagree but I very much appreciate that so we have time for one more question from the audience let's go down in front here let's go right here gentleman right here yeah yeah we're gonna bring a mic down to you right here in the front row I believe the young lady with the uh glasses was the first one oh gentleman oh it's a guy really that's a man well it's all right a gentleman we can still talk but I was wondering it's a it's a brilliant uh compilation it's really great I've been wanting to see this for years it so good I was wondering um a after making the movie were you inspired to try LSD was I inspired to try LSD no why wasn't I inspired to take LSD is the real question okay because I was surrounded by people who were taking LSD I had the unique opportunity of sitting with Dicky Albert later ramas which I thought was a very inappropriate name to take for a male homosexual because some people might misinterpret it even today but I I had the opportunity of sitting with do alred a LED man who and I respected his education of course as a series of maybe a dozen people came to see him in a hotel to talk to him about L surgic acid diol Amid and other psychedelics and I took notes I was very interested in the topic I researched it I was present during many interviews and I realized that it was essentially a subjective event that me taking it myself I did not think would give me any insight other than whoopy was that's the total of my knowledge about it I mean a related question did you think of yourself as part of the counterculture at the time did you see yourself as as in Alliance with the hippie scene or the counterculture scene or were you an observer of it the acid scene was all around me okay I was invited to acid parties okay I mean I was offered not only life surg ASD diami 25 but all kinds of so Simon and this and that everybody seemed to have their pockets bulging with different psychedelics okay and and one thing I noticed about everybody I knew who was on is that they were someplace else I'm talking about someplace else and I didn't think that me getting there so I I said to myself well I'm going to go try to get there without the stuff so I put I had while living in Paris for several years and I had read Jack London's North Star which one of my favorite books okay in which I don't know if any of you know that old book by Jack London but it's about someone who's in prison in solitary confinement and uses their own mind to travel in their mind and I tried it and it was fun I was able to go through the roof of the building I was able to see the lights of the city and so on and I I thought well let's see if I can have some fun doing this so I did I did all kinds of things within my own mind by myself and had a good time and I never felt the need to take the chemicaly Paul was asking you though when you were making M Hollywood if you felt like you were part of the counterculture was I part of The Counter Culture uh I guess from an outsider point of view I must have been but I never felt you know I mean when we get through here we're going to go to caners okay you know where he's going to be after the show yeah they reserve space for us okay and if anybody wants to pop some kind of weird stuff with cancer that's their business I'm just remembering some a funny story that Bob told me he's told he's told us that when um when he made the film and they screened it for all of the people who had participated and shared their stories and the film that all of them came up to you afterwards and said I mean I don't want to take your story away from you but they all came up and said wow you really captured my story but who were all those other freaks in the film yeah that true people came to me said Bo that you really got me but who who are all those other people and I thought this the whole thing is very subjective yeah yeah and and um who are we what are we we go we sit in the dark in a room like this or at home with our TV and we we see images we hear sounds that other people have put together and and we have experiences doing that sometimes they relate to our reality to our own memory sometimes they don't you know it's and here in Hollywood where we are this giant paved over bit of Southern California desert is where the industry came to concentrate but it exists all over the world the films are being made everywhere now and I think it's part of the human trip it's part our brains are capable of experiencing things that don't really happen to us so we see pictures and we hear sounds and we you know in fact unfortunately or unfortunately a good part of many people people's lives based upon the Illusions they got from movies from childhood on people kill themselves because their own reality doesn't match the illusion they'd see in a movie you know I am just another guy from South Philly who moved to LA in 39 my parents came here because of sign of trouble okay and I like being here it's a great place okay and that's it that's it and I'm I'm happy if anything that I do has any relevancy to anybody else well we are going to show more movies on Sunday inside red China and um how American Activities Committee which are I think are two extraordinary films and we're going to be telling some more stories so please come back Bob thank you again for coming out tonight we'll see you again on Sunday thank you so much you're welcome di thank you again so much