In the Life: Ep. 2104, "First Class Citizens"

in the life is funded in part by the H van emmering Foundation Arcus Foundation the estate of Richard W wand Dewey and lauff and these funders and by the annual support of in the Life members like you from its first episode in 1992 in the life has told the stories of groups and individuals that reflect the full spectrum of the LGBT community this month as we remember Martin Luther King's vision of equality and the African-American civil rights movement we look back at inspiring portraits of people who stood up spoke out and made a difference in the struggle for full LGBT quality we brought everybody together act up and we're married there was nothing for you in to hide make [Music] aise earlier this year the United States Senate voted to confirm both Paul ekin a gay man and Allison Nathan an out lesbian to join US District Court Judge Deborah bats on the bench of the southern district of New York more than a decade ago in the Life correspondent Jonathan Kart was there spending a day in the life of Judge bats my name is Deborah a bat and my title is United States district judge for the southern district of New York [Music] good morning okay how many doctors have been involved as a district court judge I have jurisdiction over an incredible variety of cases I have civil cases as well as criminal cases The Honorable Deborah batz became the country's first openly gay federal judge in 1994 having been recommended for the bench by Senator Daniel Patrick moan of New York I was asked if I would be interested in submitting application to be considered for a federal uh District Court judgeship uh I was delighted I said yes I was sent the application uh I filled it out uh I met with Senator moyan however change in the country's political climate was necessary before the application was given serious consideration the bush Department of Justice or Administration felt that while they thought I was very nice that my view of what a federal judge should be was not uh with their view of a federal judge should be the president of the United States when President Clinton was elected in 1992 bat's nomination finally moved forward early on the administration made clear that they wanted to seek out a diverse slate of candidates including openly gay or lesbian uh candidates for the federal bench finally I was nominated by uh President Clinton and was sworn in as a federal district court judge June 23rd 1994 which was during gay pride week the ease with which an openly gay candidate won confirmation to the federal bench took many legal observers by surprise please be seated still many felt that her confirmation had more to do with her credentials than it did with a tolerant Congress bats was an openly lesbian tenur professor at forom law school who had taught there for I I think 10 or more years and um had a very uh prestigious resume before that she was a Pres a just Law Firm she worked at the US attorney this matter is a Jered bats studied government at Radcliffe College then went on to graduate from Harvard Law School at a time when radical changes were sweeping the country I think that the timing of it the assassination of Robert Kennedy the assassination of Martin Luther King the Vietnamese War the uh uh problems that the country was roiling in at that time that was a very very strong influence uh in terms of deciding that that's what I wanted to do so that's why I wound up in law school at the time Presidential appointments to the federal bench are decidedly political and are part of an administration's Legacy but bat says a judge's job is to steer clear of politics and offer a fair interpretation of the law are they coming in tomorrow the federal judgeship is a lifetime appointment but I do think that the system of checks and balances works judges stay out of the policym role have I done this one before and get into The Fray or come into action once the legislature has done its job one place where bats is able to be more vocal on the ways gays and lesbians continue to be denied equal protection under the law is at forom University where she is a visiting Professor her courses have focused on family law marriage and adoption if we all agree that families and marriage for instance uh Prov provides positive uh effects on the individuals who are part of them uh then one might wonder what legitimate interest uh the state would have in in preventing individuals who wish to uh take advantage of those relationships as as a private person and as a mother anybody who wants to do an experience what I have should be given every opportunity to do so working toward getting more openly gay and lesbian individuals appointed at the federal level is a slow and contentious process but a crucial one that can lead to social change there are ways that judges can create social change and one is simply by the example of that they are there and that they are in a very revered prominent position in our society as an openly gay person and in of itself that is social change and it inspires social change a judge uh requires being viewed as fair and impartial so that political action is is something that we are not really able to do as judges but we still are [Music] people that you must educate yourself and educate [Music] other of the marriage movement in the following 2008 in the Life conversation Pitzer prizewinning journalist and Washington Post editorial writer Jonathan capart spoke with NAACP chairman Julian Bond about the intersection of gay rights and civil rights you've been chairman of the NAACP since 1998 correct how has the organization changed or evolved since the Civil Rights Movement well it has um change focus in a slight way because we've always had the same Focus which is fighting racial discrimination we've done that since 1909 and I I'm sorry to say we'll probably be doing it for some time in the future let's talk about the time back during the the Civil Rights Movement you've said that there were many gays and lesbians involved in the movement of course and you credited them with shaping your views on gay rights did you know Bayard Rustin yes talk about Bayard Rustin he was part of Dr King's Inner Circle he helped pull off the March on Washington in 1963 and he was gay he as as you say he was just a seminal figure in this movement and because King depended on B for so many things he was King's first educator in nonviolence and he just expanded King's knowledge of this hundredfold you know Bard wrote the first article ever published under Dr King's name I think it was I'm not sure it was in the nation magazine but an article sort of revisiting the Montgomery Bus Boycott and saying what it meant and B Rustin wrote that to say he organized the March on Washington really doesn't give him enough credit he he put this thing together now we're used to you know big protest in in Washington nowadays they happen seemed almost every week or so but this was almost the first and and it was certainly the first involving black people and it was a first involving bringing people from all over the country here in Washington for this event and Rustin just was such a superb organizer uh he pulled it off and no problems you're one of the few prominent members of the Civil Rights Movement to come out full Square in favor of gay marriage it just seems to be something right to do uh it seems to me that the right to be married is a civil right and I believe civil rights ought to be extended to everybody who who ought not have these rights what what category of people ought not have these rights I can't think of one I've been married twice and I know how what the benefits are the economic benefits are to a couple and uh I don't want to shut other people off from these benefits you opened the 20th annual creating change conference um sponsored by the national gay and lesbian task force and you said then quote like race our sexuality is not a preference it it is immutable unchangeable and the Constitution protects us all against prejudices and discrimination based on immutable differences what do you say to those who flat out disagree with that assessment well if they seem to be open to some kind of rational argument then I try to make a rational argument your sexuality is an immutable characteristic it's something you're born with you don't say hey I think I'll be gay uh you are gay when you're born or you're not gay so what is the connection between the civil rights movement and the gay civil rights movement as we know it today at the bottom it's these immutable characteristics you are what you are and you cannot be discriminated against in this country for what you are that's that's the similarity that's the closeness and the fact that the black civil rights movement came to public attention before the gay civil rights movement which is exist existing at the same time but I don't think well known to people these draw from each other and the gay movement draws tactics and techniques and and songs and slogans as did the Hispanic movement as did the women's movement and it's not that these movements are taking from us uh because the black movement took from other movements before us we took from the labor movement and I never heard of people from the labor movement complaining about this and for black people to complain about this we ought to be proud of this say look what we did we created a model that other people have followed and they followed it successfully good for us the Widow of Dr Martin Luther King that was ketta Scott King did you ever talk about this no I never did I never talked to her about this uh but I I quoted her as often as I could and when she died and it was announced that Ebenezer Baptist Church where her uh husband had been Pastor was too small for the funeral Serv ceremony and it was instead headed for a church run by a notorious homophobic minister in Atlanta I decided not to go what should gay people know about her that they might not already know well first I don't think many of them know that she was the strong advocate for uh gay rights for uh all of the things that gay people want and need uh I think her advocacy of these things is relatively unknown and when I speak to audiences and quote her I can see some of the people saying really you know happily but really and so I think they could learn some more about her she was in many ways a remarkable person and to think of her as the the wife and Widow of Martin Luther King in some ways diminishes her because she was more than that she was greater than that she had a life of her own she was an independent person uh so of course she was the wife of course she was the mother of course she was the standard Bearer after he died but she was more than that mhm you have gone basically around the country um campaigning against um anti-gay marriage amendments uh in various in in various states do you were you I mean did you voluntarily do this did people come to you and say you know we could really use your name and your stature behind this both those things happened um the naac p uh is opposed to these amendments we don't have a position on marriage equality we're neutral on that or agnostic on that uh but we do oppose these amendments because we think it's wrong to single out any group of people for special treatment and that's what these amendments do and so wherever they've raised their heads we've campaigned against them and where I've been able to physically go I've done it myself here's the closing Cosmic question I am a 17 18yearold um black kid anywhere in in the United States Urban America Rural America Suburban America exurban America and I just don't get the connection that there is even a connection between the civil rights movement that you helped lead and the gay rights movement that I see all sorts of people uh pushing in leading from people on television to people in politics um people in business why one why should I care and to what is the what is the connection convince me the connection is rights rights that's the key word these are movements for rights and these are movements to ensure that uh everyone has these rights and this 17-year-old kid uh may not think he's ever going to get married or if he's straight uh is going to marry a woman but uh this guarantees his rights and if he's not interested in his rights then I wouldn't spend much time talking with him thanks Mr Bron thank you in 1995 African-American civil rights activists planned the Million Man March on Washington DC to unite the black community against social and economic ills one of the organizers of the March was the Reverend Lewis farakhan who made numerous homophobic statements on record Keith boyin who was at the time the executive director of the national black gay and lesbian leadership Forum recounted to end the life how black gay men stood proud in response the national black gay and lesbian leadership Forum a board of directors met in September of 1995 to discuss the issue of the Million Man March at that time there was some concern about whether we wanted to encourage our members or other black lesbians and gay men to participate after very serious and careful discussion and debate we decided that we would encourage people to participate but only if they were to do so openly and visibly about who they were not to hide a part of their Identity or not to be ashamed of who they were and certainly there to be ready to challenge any sort of homophobia that might come up or any sort of instances of sexism that we felt were of concern so it was important that we participate and we participate on our own terms after that decision was made we organized a series of activities around the March uh cultural social political activities including our own rally and we marched into the um onto the mall where the event occurred and we warmly reive very enthusiastic positive responses I felt all along the March route the uh the throng of black men who line the streets and who were in the streets parted like the Red Sea when we came through chanting gay men of African descent I mean it was just a wonderful powerful motivating moving inspiring experience for me I think for all the people who were there I think what we learned from this experience though was that when we come out and when we are not ashamed about who we are as black gay men and lesbians that our community the black community not only they not only accept us they respect us [Music] more before the Stonewall Rebellion there was a group of ordinary citizens taking a stand and picketing for gay rights in front of Independence Hall in Philadelphia in the Life remembers the pioneering work started by Frank Camy and Barbara Giddings this is the front of the famous Independence Hall in Philadelphia and this is where we had gay picketing demonstrations every July 4 from 1965 through 1969 people think of the Stonewall Rebellion as um uh the start of the gay civil rights movement that's a myth there was a movement starting back in the late 1940s and it gradually evolved and it picked up steam and we were doing this very revolutionary picketing in the 1960s before Stonewall ever happened these are these are stacks of various gay related uh picketing signs from a variety of demonstrations in Washington and also Philadelphia in the middle 60s um activism and expressions of descent hadn't uh reached the levels that they did by the latter 60s and picketing in some such places as the front of the White House was the extreme expression of descent par exons things haven't gone beyond that yet there had been a big debate within the gay movement about whether or not we should have public demonstrations and a lot of it was based on the fear we thought boy if somebody knew you were gay they'd Stone you to death or you know attack you you know we didn't dare walk holding a sign saying that we were homosexuals see in those days people thought it was very much smarter to uh pass and uh that people who didn't want to pass were in just inviting trouble nobody was out then I was probably certainly for example in my group down here I was the only person who used my own [Music] name those early pickets were scary it was scary because there were so few of us who could take the risk of being so public for example um what if my boss sees me on the 6:00 news and fires me or what if my picture appears on the front page of my parents Hometown newspaper and causes grief or shock waves in the town and what if some bystander starts throwing insults at us or Worse bricks or Stones uh and what is the government going to do with all those photographs and tape recordings that they're taking of us we had a dress code and it's easy easy now to look back 35 years later and um laugh at it and make fun of it because it was a very strict code but I think it was appropriate for the time and I strongly supported it at the time and I think it was right then because we were trying to get across a very unpopular message we didn't want people to gawk at us we wanted them to gawk at the messages on our signs and and in our leaflets well the philosoph y um was to make us look normal the way everybody else looked so did we succeeded so well that uh as Frank Cy said um some people thought we were actors I remember specifically when we picketed in front of the Civil Service Commission my uh uh um my Approach was they we want them to employ us therefore within the normal mode of the day uh uh we have to give the appearance of being employable we were representing we felt all those hundreds of thousands and millions of other Americans that were homosexual this is Independence National his what we saw it was it a chance to remind Americans on July 4th that we were equal citizens and uh what better place to do that than in front of the Liberty Bell Independence hold where the thing was done both the Declaration of Independence um and uh the Constitution we're right there it was right after the parade the July 4th parade and the uh the folding chairs were stacked up still and then everything had been dismantled the bleachers so then we came on and and pick it it I just felt a sense of of commitment and a sense of uh passionate involvement you know it didn't bother me if people were negative and there was a surprising lack of negativity there on the part of bystanders I think they they were surprised but they didn't give us any trouble that I recall there was a photographer there who told me that all I needed was a good man you know just or perhaps he even said that all I needed to do was sleep with the man and and I I said something like I didn't need that or something and I I just filmed you know and he stuck out his tongue at me otherwise it went all fine and then at the end uh on a signal everybody we had you know signs on sticks and everybody flipped down their signs the demonstration was over once the flag Loring music that was from the loudspeaker uh started and we saw the flag Loring we all stood and uh put our right hand over our heart just to show that we were uh good people rots we respected the flag you know we were first class American citizens and we have wanted that's a message we have wanted we had wanted to tell everyone from the beginning we're first class citizens we are not marginal people I feel that those demonstrations led directly into stone war in 69 and that without our demonstration starting in ' 65 Stonewall would not have happened because what they did was to create the mindset for gay people who had never ever before done this to demonstrate publicly to disent publicly to to do things out in the open and no nobody had ever done this before the 1969 demonstration took took place just about a week after the Stonewall rebellion in New York City a lot of people who were fired up by the fight against the police at Stonewall came down to Philadelphia or came from other cities into Philadelphia and joined the demonstration and it was the largest we had ever had there were about 150 people that sounds like very little today but for us it was a huge turnout here we saw uh and blue jeans t-shirts we saw a mixture it that like the transition from the old to the new all of this it was sort of a movement pulling itself up by its bootstraps if you want to pursue the metaphor we created the bootstraps and then other people pulled and pulled and pulled and up it went and pretty soon you have um marches on Washington with hundreds of thousands of [Applause] people you know coming out in a picket line in 1965 was downright revolutionary for that time it took gumption it really took gumption and the conviction that we were right and the world was wrong we were just at the start of cracking that Cocoon of invisibility thank you for watching in the life to watch more historical coverage from the last 20 years of in the Life visit our website at it media.org we were working for rights and for a full first class of citizenship in our society and we were never going to get it as long as there their ideas prevailed you had a whole establishment that had to be changed and reversed and in order to get them to do that you had to use political tactics if we don't attend to the violence if we don't address violence if we don't look at the underlying causes of it not only homophobia religious extremism and government autocracy we are never going to be able to really achieve achieve our goals which are human rights for LGBT people everywhere in the life is funded in part by the H van amaran Foundation Arcus Foundation the estate of Richard W wand Dewey and labuff and these funders and by the annual support of in the Life members like [Music] you